The horizon is not so far as we can see, but as far as we can imagine

Open Thread

Had some computer issues today, so no post. Feel free to use comments to discuss topics unrelated to recent posts.

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  1. Thomas B Golladay

    What is interesting here is some State Legislatures suing their own States , piggy backing on the Texas suite and asking the court to uphold the Electors Clause and remand the dispute to the State Legislatures.

    Ultimately the court has to take the case or Civil War is inevitable.

  2. NR

    Right-wingers agitating for civil war because they can’t accept that their Dear Leader lost the election is really something.

  3. Hugh

    I have a new motto for the Republican party:

    Elections!?! We don’t need no stinkin’ elections!

    Raise your hands if you think those 18 Republican Attorney-Generals and 100 House members would sign on to a lawsuit contesting the election if it was a Democratic President doing it.

    BTW Ken Paxton the Texas AG is a complete whack job. So he doesn’t actually need a reason for anything he does, but if you wanted a reason, it could be that he’s pardon shopping with Trump. He’s been under indictment for securities fraud in a case that is primarily noteworthy for moving with glacial slowness. The facts of the case, by contrast, are pretty simple. Paxton steered a couple of people to invest in a company without telling them that the CEO of said company gave a hundred thousand shares for free to Paxton, and Paxton didn’t tell the marks he recruited about his own involvement with the company. Of course, the CEO later stated that he hadn’t charged Paxton for the stock because God had told him not to. So there’s that. But a pardon would still come in handy just in case Paxton gets a fair jury.

  4. Zachary Smith

    I suppose I’ve made it clear the Warmongering WP isn’t a site I much like, but I’ll give credit where it’s due.

    “No, President Trump can’t pardon himself”Dec. 8, 2020

    IMO the logic is ironclad.

  5. Willy

    I can remember back when the mystery of the day was how many licks it took to get to the center of a tootsie roll pop. The answer turned out to be three. Today’s mystery is how many times can conservative evangelicals be wrong about the 2020 presidential election. I think the answer is going to be around eleventy billion.

    I can also remember back when the Dictator of El Salvador warned his neighbors that his would be a mighty and formidable army once they got their tank out of the repair shop. Today we have the Elite Strike Force, who, once they get out of the Covid hospital, shall be even more mighty and formidable just as Donald Trump was. At least that’s what their fans are saying. We’ll have Pooty Rudy, Typhoid Jenna, the unsinkable Melissa Carrone, and maybe as an added bonus, the mighty Sidney Powell shall return with her firehoses full of Kracken.

    Be ready people.

  6. Zachary Smith

    The Hullabaloo site is one you’ve got to watch. Right now there is a piece there moaning and groaning about the evil Russian Intervention which prevented Our Blessed Lady Hillary from claiming her rightful throne in 2016.

    But directly below that one is this:

    Iran’s President Hassan Rouhani said Wednesday that U.S. sanctions are making it difficult for Iran to purchase medicine and health supplies from abroad, including COVID-19 vaccines needed to contain the worst outbreak in the Middle East.

    The comment the blogger makes about the situation pretty well sums it all up:

    “This administration is killing massive numbers of Americans. Of course it doesn’t care about the mass death of Iranian civilians. “

    Trump has proved he doesn’t give a damn about American lives, and sure isn’t going to care much about dead Iranians.

  7. Youtube is not only censoring and suppressing information on hydroxychloroquine; it’s also censoring information on ivermectin, which apparently works even better than hydroxychloroquine, though it also requires early intervention. Source is the excellent Chris Martenson, Ph.D., originally just aggregating hydroxychloroquine studies info, also has an ivermectin section (plus others like vit. D and zinc)

    Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., has come out against mRNA covid vaccines in a big way, suggesting that NOBODY take it:

    I am curious as to whether all covid vaccines are of the mRNA type.

    I believe Texas,, will prevail in the Supreme Court. However, the rot at the state level is so extensive that I don’t consider it a sure thing, at all, that even Republican dominated state legislators will push Trump over the finish line, in a contingent election process.

  8. Hugh

    So metamars thinks that if Trump and the Republicans can just score a little more hydroxychloroquine they will be able to steal the election they lost after all.

  9. NR

    It’s worth calling attention to the fact that right-wingers want the Supreme Court to throw out the votes of tens of millions of Americans and disenfranchise the voters of four entire states because they don’t like the way they voted.

    Right-wingers are fascists and the mask is fully off now.

  10. I welcome some civil war action, Thomas, my targets are already laid in: every little red NRA dot in the back window of your truck, right behind your head; speakin’ of heads: every red hat; every asshole desecrating the flag, wearing it around their head like some kind of asswipe, flying off the back of your truck through the mud, carbon dioxide and road-wash.

    You want a civil war, boi? Bring. It. On. I’m tired of waiting.

  11. bruce wilder

    pot, kettle, black

    The Dems are dancing the same waltz as the Republicans with regard to the legitimacy of elections.

    Hugh asks a counterfactual “would Republicans, if a Democratic President?” with zero memory of how Lady Hillary and Company responded to her 2016 loss, with baseless accusations of treasonous collusion and pleas for faithless electors, after having been exposed in a scheme to circumvent campaign finance limits in ways that undermined their own Party.

    The big news of this election is being obscured: the Democrats lost ground in every way, everywhere except Biden’s bid for the White House, and all the last accomplished was a return to power of the same predatory crew Obama and Clinton used to destroy the country. Lesser evil predators and incompetents than Trump furnished. Whoop-de-do!

  12. Jeremy

    Q. – “I am curious as to whether all covid vaccines are of the mRNA type.”

    A. –


  13. Plague Species

    No reason to fret fellow ruminators, the vaccine is here and all will be well in the garden again. The vaccine will allow us to go back to normal. You know normal, don’t you? Normal is what we were before the vaccine and before Trump. In that sense, Biden is effectively (as if) a vaccine for Trump and the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are a safeguard against dying from COVFEFE-45.

    Note that the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines, the mRNA vaccines, do not prevent you from contracting the virus. Instead, they prevent your immune system from killing you in reaction to the virus. The transform the effects of the virus into a mild cold case. They prevent the dreaded Cytokine Storm from manifesting, or at least they do 95% of the time. So, you can still contract the virus just as readily statistically speaking, and most likely you can shed it too and infect others with it.

    This sets up an interesting predicament. I have no doubt Biden will shore up and bolster AFRICOM in the next four years. It is part of his administration’s mission. As a check on China’s expansionist efforts there. What we’ll have is Americans climbing all over Africa who have received this vaccine and are conducting business as usual as though they’re not contagious, spreading COVFEFE-45, which by that time will be COVFEFE-46, far and wide across Africa because you can be damn sure this vaccine will never be available to Africans (they can’t get affordable AIDS drugs for Christ’s sake) as part of an effective far-reaching vaccine campaign. It’s smallpox blankets all over again, except this time on the African continent versus North America. These people are sick. Demented. Criminally insane.

    There never was a normal and there certainly won’t be anything resembling normal, whatever normal is, going forward. There instead will be increasing degrees of insanity with no upper limit on the number of degrees.

    Meanwhile, Trump has turned the White House into PardonMart where political hound dogs vie for pardons from Oh McDonald by performing the most bizarre and ludicrous clown acts they can possibly imagine.

  14. @Jeremy Thanks. Will bookmark these.

    Even if safe and effective vaccines are developed, to have denied citizens in so many countries of useful prophylaxes and therapeutics is criminal. At least morally. If I were a billionaire, I’d organize a class action lawsuit against Fauci, Redford, and Azar for conspiracy to defraud the public, which resulted in massive manslaughter. Even if thrown out, or even (miraculously) found to be baseless (in the court’s opinion), it would at least draw attention to those most responsible for the high death toll from covid.

    One would think that lefties preoccupied with the sins of capitalism would be more outspoken about the crying need of LOW PROFIT (see what I did there?) therapeutics; yet some of these same supposed lefties, while endlessly haranguing us about more scientifically dubious “strategies”, like mask wearing, are silent about the government failure to educate and make maximally available low cost prophylaxes and therapeutics. Some of these folks are so ignorant and fanatical, that, e.g., they blame “racism” for the high toll amongst African Americans, and say nothing about their pathetically high rate of Vitamin D insufficiency (about double that of whites, in the US). A condition that could easily be addressed, with extremely cost effective “free” vitamin D provided for those that would have trouble affording that very cheap supplement.

    BTW, I caught the Randi Rhodes show, live, last week, and she showed a doctor who was still – after all this time & studies – saying hydroxychloroquine is useless. She seems way too smart to be this ignorant, so I assume she’s simply lying by omission. She did tell a woman who called in, who lost a loved one, that she was shedding tears for her loss. I can’t remember, exactly, but apparently it was all Donald Trump’s fault, so her tears were OK. If this woman has to live in terror of coming down with covid, and loses more of her loved ones, well, dammit, all the more reason to hate Trump and the Republicans! Only one solution, obviously! Vote Democratic!

    Puritan’s Pride brand of 2,000 IU vitamin D, 100 per bottle, sells for $3.19. So, 3 cents per day, would provide substantial benefit. Tony Fauci’s reputed dosage of 6,000 IU per day would cost 10 cents per day. This dosage is probably closer to optimal for a white person, of his age. But it’s likely a black person of his age could do better with 8,000 IU, or a whopping 12 cents per day. Higher doses of D should be given with vitamin K2, so up that by a few pennies more.

    Political fanatacism, tribalistically reinforced ignorance and denial, an unmitigated greed may be killing us, but lack of resources, collectively, is not.

    * Maybe for the worse possible of reasons. I do take seriously the “Great Reset” conspiracy, even if I don’t talk about it much. After all, such putative do-gooders as Bill Gates surely know about Vitamin D – with his bucks, he could guarantee massive adoption of vitamin D sufficiency, and it’d probably be chump change, for him. Yet, he wants to vaccinate the world….

    Your second reference says, “Additionally, there are indications that respiratory viruses are especially difficult to protect against with vaccines.” Aw, but Bill Gates is as undaunted in pursuing his questionable aims, as is Randi Rhodes in ‘explaining’, as she always does: reductio ad Republicans

    “clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right”

  15. Plague Species

    The assumption is, the vaccines are perfectly safe for the most part and what choice do we have any way? mRNA vaccines have never been tested on humans before. What Pfizer and Moderna have done can hardly be called testing. The possible implications are largely unknown. What are some of the potential implications? They’re probably too numerous to list. Here’s one possibility.

    Injecting such large doses of mRNA into tissues is definitely not natural. Here’s one scenario: what if nerve cells take up the vaccine’s mRNA and start producing a lot of copies of the spike protein, which leads to protein aggregate/plaque formation and increases risk for developing neurodegenerative diseases down the road? There’s no way I would take any mRNA vaccine until we had a decade worth of safety data on it.

    The Media is owned by Big Pharma and so too, in fact, is the government.

    There is no evidence about the length of effectiveness of the vaccine. In fact, it’s more a biologic than a vaccine, in effect. It’s plausible its effects related to the virus decline precipitously after a month or two months or three, meaning you would need to be vaccinated again and again every few months if COVFEFE-45 turns out to be with us in perpetuity like the flu. That’s great for Big Pharma because now they will have a revenue and profit stream in perpetuity with the added benefit that if neuro-degenerative conditions arise from the vaccine many years later that are never attributed to the vaccine, they can develop new revenue and profit streams for those conditions as well. The gift that keeps on giving. It’s Matrix-like, you have to admit. We’re just biological meat sacks ripe for exploitation of every conceivable manner. We’re just a means to an end who delusionally believe we’re something more than that.

  16. dbk

    –I am curious as to whether all covid vaccines are of the mRNA type.–

    The second generation of vaccines, anticipated to advance to wide-scale trials in 2021, rely on several more traditional, tried-and-true technology (e.g., inactivated virus).


  17. Plague Species

    That’s great for Big Pharma because now they will have a revenue and profit stream in perpetuity with the added benefit that if neurodegenerative conditions arise from the vaccine many years later that are never attributed to the vaccine, they can develop new revenue and profit streams for those conditions as well.

    Big Pharma ensures the longer term side effects are never attributed to the drug, in this case vaccine, because they use the little trick of unblinding the study after the initial results and then administering the drug to the placebo group thus eliminating the benchmark for side effects.

    If you review the link I provided above and read the commentary, you can see operatives at work in the commentary. They are strongly advocating the placebo group in these studies be the first to receive the vaccine because otherwise it would be unethical. How would it be any more unethical than denying a more at risk group of people the vaccine first because you were so adamant the placebo group get it first? Point being, the operatives are not in the least interested in ethics. They are priming the public to support Big Pharma’s trickery in eliminating the benchmark for vaccine side effects. Once the placebo group receives the vaccine, and the sooner the better for Bog Pharma, side effects can then be attributed to anything versus the vaccine. Plausible deniability. Big Pharma is inoculated, one of many ways, from liability.

  18. jo6pac

    I can’t donate 25.00 on pay pal and I can’t change it to 5.00.

  19. Plague Species

    Kudos to him. It’s more than can be said for Biden and Mika & Joe who have remained silent on the subject. What is your stance on this, Bockaria Joe? What is your stance, Doug Jones, considering you’re Bockaria Joe’s pick for AG? Afterall, you and Rebekah share the same last name so you’re family. Or will you be too busy prosecuting 50 year old civil rights cases as token acts of symbolism rather than fighting the fascism currently in your face?

    But after state law enforcement officers raided the home of former Department of Health employee Rebekah Jones, Filipkowski said the issue is “now a legal one rather than just medical,” and he decided that “I no longer wish to serve the current government of Florida in any capacity.”

  20. Ché Pasa

    Yes, well. The Russia Thing began well before the 2016 election as some kind of idiotic revival of the repeated Red Scares of the 20th century. The Russian Federation had been targeted for dismantlement in the PNAC paper of 1999, and The Schedule called for ramping up the anti-Soviet… er… Russia propaganda so as to gear up for said dismantlement. The election just so happened to coincide. How convenient.

    While plenty of individuals and opiners of various stripes were happy to claim that “Russian Interference” was the proximate cause of Mrs. Clinton’s loss to Trump in the Electoral College, neither she nor Democratic officials in general made that claim. Nor was that what the Mueller Investigation was about. Instead, they were — as some still are — claiming that there was Russian interference/involvement in the election (which there was) and that Trump and his campaign were associated with Russians who in turn were close associates of Putin (The Devil) and that the Russian influence assisted Trump and his campaign and amounted to illegal collusion — which is plausible though so far somewhat murky and unproven, and is by no means the reason why Mrs. Clinton lost.

    Whatever the case, the whole Russia Thing exists and has existed independently of the 2016 election. It’s part of a long-term project to remake globe under the rubric of the New American Century. It is not going well. It has not gone well since the ill-advised “re-making” of the Middle East c. 2002 and subsequently. All of the destruction and catastrophic failures since then can be traced to the plans outlined in PNAC documents and personnel.

    These persistent failures led to a shift of emphasis away from the Middle East and Russia to China, the Great Red Dragon, and the final conquest in the Plan put forward so long ago. China is resisting, but for how much longer? Hard to say. At any rate, the Russia Thing faded away because it was unwinnable and ultimately there was no point to it. On the other hand, there is no doubt that Russia is currently beset with internal and external revolts and problems, some obviously induced destabilization…

    As for foreign policy propaganda, it will be China, China, China from now on. We’ll see similar processes play out as we’ve seen over and over again for decades. And failure. Plenty of failure.

    Meanwhile, Israel is going ahead with its own Middle Eastern Project and assembling what looks to be a Middle Eastern alliance to attack and dismantle Iran.

    Meanwhile this virus is spreading unchecked through the United States and much of the world leaving millions sick or dead.

    Meanwhile, climate catastrophe is growing closer every day.



  21. Willy

    Bruce, the difference is that most on the left admitted that Hillary was a poor candidate. This is hardly cult thinking. And then there’s that bit where trading democracy for fascism isn’t just some slightly greater evil. Plus we’ll be stuck with millions of far-right cultists who’ve lost respect for reality. Do you know a single one of them who can accurately blame the current American condition on anything remotely realistic? I just listened to one who blames neoliberalism on far-left socialists, a staunch Trumper who claims to be a PhD.
    So will lowly, socialist-clunker outfits like Canada and Britain beat the mighty Operation Trump Speed when it comes to effective vaccinating?

  22. Hugh

    Reality to bruce, how many Republican lawmakers supported Clinton’s attempts to contest the 2016 election?

    metamars manages to attack the response to the virus without mentioning Trump, you know the President, once. Don’t worry there’s still time to not wear a mask, drink bleach, and shine bright lights down your throat.

    A traditional vaccine carries proteins from the surface of a virus or microbe your body can form antibodies to. An mRNA vaccine is a short-lived template so your body can form some of those proteins. Your immune response then will form antibodies to them as it does with the traditional vaccine. The difference is the mRNA vaccine is more targeted –in the case of covid-19 to its distinctive spike protein which the virus uses to attach to cells.

  23. BlizzardOfOzzz

    It turns out your inner-city Riggers will have to defend their actions in court after all! Not quite so smug now, are we? Don’t worry though, the 3am Biden vote fairy surely did not leave a trail of evidence a mile wide.

  24. Ten Bears

    It’s long been my contention the Ruskies by all accounts ran the perfect con, the perfect game, but for a couple of things: the mark… the rube, the pigeon, trump; and the Ruskies themselves are a mark… a rube, a pigeon in some grander game. Who’s pushing all these pawns around, whose grander game? The answer is never the answer. What’s really interesting is the mystery.

  25. Lex

    What the Russians did in 2016 is what both countries have been doing to each other and third countries for decades. Usually it doesn’t work in “developed” nations. It did work in Russia, 1996 leading to the Wall Street/Clinton boom years while Russia was pillaged. Note Putin was granted the highest office by Yeltsin’s resignation before he ran an election. And like Yeltsin, Trump was the perfect buffoon for the play to work. I would imagine that in Russian offices there’s still amazement that the play worked so much better than they could have predicted. The goal was merely to delegitimize the US both abroad and undermine its internal stability. They wanted to give us our very own Yeltsin. Unfortunately for us, trump is far worse than Yeltsin.

  26. S Brennan

    Once again Tulsi Gabbard does the right thing…while the vast majority of D’s spend all their time trying to please their wealthy donor base.

    Tulsi Gabbard Bill Would Bar Transgender Athletes From Women’s Sports

    And since this blogs comment section has become a DNC megaphone, dedicated to defending the indefensible, using the Orwellian precept of making lies sound truthful, a place where the freedom of speech is construed to be the right to shout-down anyone who dares to say that “two plus two make four” or…any other manifestation of truth that runs counter to the ever-changing one party dictata.

    For the record, I am [and have been] for transgender rights in employment/public-accommodation/housing as elucidated by Supreme Court Justice Neil M. Gorsuch in his June 2020 majority opinion in support of a 6-3 ruling. That Gorsuch opinion was joined by Chief Justice John Roberts and stands in stark contrast to congressional Democrats who’s previous efforts on the subject had tried to write bills in such a manner to confer civil rights only to gays who followed accepted gender roles while, specifically excluding transgenders and those who did not conform to gender norms. Let’s give a big shout out to Barney Frank and his besty, Nancy Pelosi those two crazy party hacks that have always manged to be wrong on war and…on civil rights.

  27. Hugh

    The vote by electors in states for President will take place this Monday December 14. Aside from the alternating unhinged tirades and whimpering from Trump and the increasingly desperate magical thinking of all those Anhänger des orangen Führers, the election is done and just gets doner.

  28. Trinity

    Yes, well. The Russia Thing began well before the 2016 election as some kind of idiotic revival of the repeated Red Scares of the 20th century.

    Echoing Lex, and agreeing with Che, the whole Russia Thing is a long-term project/device to eliminate support for socialism in any form.

    And again, the only real difference between Repugnant and Demented are the talking points they utilize to retain or gain power, especially useful are the ones that promise nothing (e.g. “I’m Not Him”). Yes, there are outliers. Given that, I fancy at some point Bernie received a set of high res images of people he cares about taken with a long range lens. This would explain a lot, if true.

  29. Mike Adams of naturalnews thinks the unthinkable, in “Situation Update, Dec. 11th – DoD de-fangs the CIA, 305th intel proves foreign interference, SCOTUS maneuvers”

    It is clear from troop movements, U.S. Navy activities, military flight tracking and intel from my military-connected sources that the military is being readied for the possibility of domestic deployment in January. The likely timing of this would be immediately after Jan. 6th.

    My best assessment of where we are right now
    In my assessment, there is a solid chance — say 50/50 — that SCOTUS sides with Texas. If that occurs, there is around a 90% chance that Trump emerges the victor from the various remedies that would be prescribed by SCOTUS.

    Simultaneously, there is a small chance — say 20% — that Biden concedes before the end of December. This is the best outcome as it avoids most of the more serious bloodshed scenarios.

    However, there remains roughly a 50% chance that none of the efforts by Trump will succeed, and that on Jan. 6th, Congress will accept electors that solidify the Biden “win,” despite all the irrefutable evidence of vote fraud, foreign interference, China’s hold over the Bidens, etc. In this scenario, Trump is almost certain to invoke the national security option, which puts America in a similar position to Abraham Lincoln’s war powers acts in 1862.

    The advantage of this scenario is that it allows Trump to mass arrest all the deep state traitors, enemy combatants, China puppets, CIA black hat operatives and other corrupt officials, all at once and completely outside the usual civilian court system (which itself is corrupt). The scary part in this scenario is that it puts the USA under some form of military rule, with the possibility that Trump might even suspend habeas corpus.

  30. NR

    It’s interesting that this supposedly “irrefutable” evidence of voter fraud has been refuted by 50 different courts so far. Oh, but wait, all those judges (including ones appointed by Trump) are all part of the Deep State/CIA/China conspiracy too!

    People, take note: this is what right-wingers *actually believe.*

  31. Hugh

    Oh, that Mike Adams. You mean the founder of Natural News which wiki describes as “an anti-vaccination conspiracy theory and fake news website known for promoting pseudoscience and far-right extremism.”


    “The website sells various dietary supplements, promotes alternative medicine and climate change denial, makes tendentious nutrition and health claims, disseminates fake news, and espouses various conspiracy theories and pro-Donald Trump propaganda.”

    Well, alright then.

  32. Ten Bears

    Blind boars and acorns. I keep telling people if they don’t eat shit they won’t smell like it and Natural News apparently agrees with me, though about not much else. My mother reads it, sends me stuff, often pretty good cooking with less orientation to meat, and their exercise regimen isn’t to be sneezed at but otherwise pretty well lost in the ozone. I thought Mike Adams was/is the mypillowdotcom guy, so it wouldn’t surprise me. Wasn’t quite so off-the-wall even as recently as five years ago, kind of a sad commentary on how quickly these things spiral out of control.

  33. Hugh

    Well SCOTUS just canned indicted Texas AG Ken Paxton’s whackadoodle suit trying to overturn the election which Trump and a bunch of cowardly Republicans joined. Not surprising. Only Alito and Thomas would have heard it not on its merits but as a matter of form (i.e. guarding its turf). Here’s the text of the order:

    “The State of Texas’s motion for leave to file a bill of complaint is denied for lack of standing under Article III of the Constitution. Texas has not demonstrated a judicially cognizable interest in the manner in which another State conducts its elections. All other pending motions are dismissed as moot.

    Statement of Justice Alito, with whom Justice Thomas joins: In my view, we do not have discretion to deny the filing of a bill of complaint in a case that falls within our original jurisdiction. See Arizona v. California, 589 U. S. ___ (Feb. 24, 2020) (Thomas, J., dissenting). I would therefore grant the motion to file the bill of complaint but would not grant other relief, and I express no view on any other issue.”

    Ouch, but I doubt it will have much effect on the Trump true believers. It will be just more grist for their conspiracy mill.

  34. NR

    Never forget that 17 Republican Attorneys General, along with 126 Republican Congressmen, attempted to overthrow democracy in America and install Donald Trump as an unelected dictator.

  35. Hugh

    According to John Hopkins we are currently at nearly 295,000 dead in the US from covid. This is already more than the 291,000 combat deaths of World War II, and before it’s all over we will surpass the 405,000 the US lost in that war. Thanks, Donald.

  36. Never forget that, in spite of 2,000 sworn affidavits so far, sworn under penalty of perjury, vote fraud and illegal vote denialists continue to whine about legal challenges to the selection – err, I mean the election – of 2020.

  37. NR

    I love how people say “sworn affidavits” like it’s some sort of silver bullet. That pile of “sworn affidavits” includes things like a guy reporting that his ballot was “suspiciously clean” and another guy reporting that he “infiltrated an Antifa meeting in Colorado where Rirc Coomer admitted to rigging the election.”

    At any rate, that pile of “sworn affidavits” was examined by 50 different courts and all of them–every single one–concluded they had no merit.

    Now, which of the following is more likely:

    a) Doug Ducey, Brian Kemp, the statewide Republican officeholders in Arizona and Georgia, Alito, Barrett, Kavaunaugh, Thomas, Gorsuch, and William Bart are all part of a deep state conspiracy involving North Koreans, Venezuelans, Hugo Chavez (who’s dead by the way), China and the FBI,


    b) Trump lost the election and is an insane liar.

  38. Well, so much for my legal opinion about Trump’s chances with the Supreme Court.

    It remains to be seen if Trump will chose the martial law route. Of course, even if he attempts it, it’s not clear that the military would obey him. Trump has been mysteriously ineffective in dealing with the Deep State for all of his term. Note that he hasn’t fired Barr, even after it became clear that Wray sat on exculpatory evidence for Gen Flynn, and Barr didn’t fire Wray. I assumed, and still assume, that they have dirt on Trump. That and/or he’s too weak or cowardly.

    However, Biden is likely a national security risk; furthermore, some of the headlines in the alternative press are claiming proof exists of manipulation of vote tallies, overseas. (Distinct from merely tabulating votes, overseas.) So, I think Trump has a basis for declaring a national security emergency, as Mike Adams has brainstormed. And this will obviously receive some sympathy amongst some military, though the details are what matters; and this is what is not known.

    I can’t remember, for the life of me, the name of the “last honest Spartan”, who tried to resist the terminal degeneration of Sparta into a selfish oligarchy. I often remember (but only vaguely), the general outline of the story, if that.

    Basically, when your countrymen are rife with corruption, your principled stand is likely to be your last one…. Does anybody know who I am talking about? I duckduckgo’ed “last honest Spartan” and “decline of Sparta”, but didn’t see anything like I was looking for in the first 2 pages.

  39. “At any rate, that pile of “sworn affidavits” was examined by 50 different courts and all of them–every single one–concluded they had no merit.”

    Snicker. I can see you’ve been paying attention.

    There’s also the inconvenient fact that 2,000+ is a very recent tally. A couple of weeks or so ago is was ‘only’ 1,000+. How did the courts that ruled before the 2,000 mark was reach read affidavits that didn’t exist, yet?

    Your lies are low-investment swill.

  40. Hugh

    Never forget that, you could get 2,000 sworn affidavits, sworn under penalty of perjury, from people that swear they’ve been kidnapped by aliens and experimented on using PROBES. The reason that more than 50 Trump lawsuits have been tossed is because they fail at the level of standing or timeliness. They fail because they have no evidence or only joke evidence (vacuous affidavits) to back them up. Curiously, Trump true believers don’t get that their delusions, even sworn to, don’t amount to serious evidence.

  41. Eric Anderson

    And Trump’s final farce fails:

  42. NR

    And as far as “sworn under penalty of perjury,” that almost never comes up when it comes to affidavits.

    As the Trump campaign will remind you, these are sworn statements. But according to legal experts, the jeopardy faced by those behind them is relatively minimal.

    “There is a remote chance that sworn statements (if they are actually sworn statements — most documents that appear to be ‘sworn’ don’t count within the meaning of the statute) could subject the declarant to some exposure under the perjury statutes,” said Lisa Kern Griffin, an expert on evidence at Duke University, in an email. “But perjury prosecutions are rare and almost never arise from statements outside of the context of proceedings in which oaths are formally administered — such as depositions, congressional testimony, grand jury proceedings, or trial testimony.”

    A key issue is whether the affidavit is filed in court, as most filed by the Trump team haven’t been.

    So it’s true that not all of these “sworn affidavits” were examined by courts, but that’s because they didn’t submit them to courts, because they knew the wouldn’t stand up to scrutiny. Here’s one of those “affidavits SWORN UNDER PENALTY OF PERJURY” that they *did* submit:

    During a Nov. 19 news conference, Rudy Giuliani, a lawyer representing President Donald Trump, charged that many precincts in Michigan — a key state won by his Democratic opponent, President-elect Joe Biden — recorded more votes than actual voters.

    In Michigan, he said, “we have over-votes in numerous precincts of 150%, 200% and 300%.”

    Giuliani’s source for these percentages was an affidavit authored by Russell Ramsland, a security consultant and former Republican congressional candidate. The document alleges that anomalies in the vote count indicate that Michigan election results were “manipulated.”

    “There were at least 19 precincts where the Presidential Votes Cast compared to the Estimated Voters based on Reported Statistics exceeded 100%,” the affidavit reads. The document then goes on to list the 19 precincts, shown in this screenshot:

    But there’s a problem, and it’s a big one: All 19 of the precincts cited in the affidavit are actually in Minnesota, not Michigan.

    But of course, the only reason they lost in court was a giant Deep State conspiracy.

  43. S Brennan

    While Ian comment section has become a liars paradise….

    Yesterday, a giant of my youth died. He was born in an age of giants. Gen. [ret.] Yeager was born when it was common to see giants striding this earth, when good people did not cower in fear, when good soldiers were expected to shoulder their share and then to shoulder fifty pounds more.

    Chuck Yeager has passed his earthly existence; I recommend this eulogy for it notes in his passing that the upward ladder that was the norm in Gen. [ret.] Yeager’s life has been splintered and burned in a bonfire to the vanities.

    Personally, I climbed such a ladder and mourn both; the passing of the ladder and the man who rose to it’s highest rung. Rest in Peace Gen [ret.] Yeager. God Bless America and for the love of my fellow citizens, let it return to it’s glory, where all men, who are created equal, are then consigned to push themselves upward.

  44. Aaron

    I see you almost never discuss Canada. Have you seen the latest news that Canada hosted Chinese PLA officials for cold weather military training? And that Trudeau was furious when the military decided to cancel troop exercises after the two “Michaels” were detained by China?

    Trudeau seems to be hurtling down a slippery slope.

    I don’t know if you like the NY Post link, but some news never comes up in MSM.

  45. Hugh

    Trumpers don’t need facts or evidence or elections. They have the truth, and the truth is whatever they believe. Anyone (the rest of us) and anything (reality) are liars and heretics because we do not bow down before their ridiculous orange messiah.

  46. Ten Bears

    Tulsi, your slip is showing.

  47. S Brennan


    Your misogyny is showing…but hey, your hate speech is okay as long as you’re blue…no matter who.

    And that’s the beauty of simplistic tribal thinking, as long as your with the crowd, the lynching minorities or, anybody who stands up for them is okay.

    That’s the polite response, now go fuck yourself.

  48. I used to have an Indian friend who told me that politics was much more corrupt in India, than the US. One of their politicians was known to have had somebody killed, and still got elected.

    He told me that there was a joke about the relative corruption.

    An Indian politician is visiting and American politician in his palatial home, and asks how he was able to afford it. The American draws apart the window shade, and asks, “Do you see that bridge? I built it.”

    Later, the American visits the Indian politician in his palatial home, 10x over. He asks, “how can you afford this”? The Indian draws back the curtain on the window, and asks, “Do you see this magnificent bridge? I built it!” The American looks, and sees …. nothing.

    Some years ago, I was chatting with the head of the physics department at NJIT, who is (or was) Indian. He told me that the corruption he sees in Newark, by James Sharpe, is so open, that it reminds him of India.

    In this vein:

    I like to think the US deserves better than “electing” the head of a crime family, whose son – a bagman of the family – is effectively abused by the father. His ill-gotten gains are used to finance the son’s drug and hooker problems. Gee, whiz, we can even see (partially obscured) videos of a hooker massaging Hunter’s penis with her feet. The Biden apologists must be SO proud!

    In India, on Dec. 2, 250 million Indians went on strike. Don’t know what happened, and will happen, next. But I can see a day when US citizens will have to do similarly, if they want to salvage any freedom and self-determination, at all.

    Some of the most compelling testimony against the illegal ballot counting processes ‘administered’ by Democratic controlled polling stations was by an Indian American woman, an immigrant. (No link handy). I think she makes a fine American, that her fellow citizens can be proud of. The cheaters, stealers, whore-mongers, and whore-monger-enablers, and their apologists : not so much.

  49. NR

    And I like to think that the U.S. deserves better than to have people calling for it to turn into a fascist dictatorship because they can’t deal with the fact that their cult leader lost an election, but here we are.

  50. Hugh

    Yes, if only Biden’s son had been as morally pure as Trump and his kids. Good thing metamars knows what Hunter’s penis looks like too. Thank you for a LOL moment and have a stormy daniels day.

  51. S Brennan

    “the U.S. deserves better than to have people calling for it to turn into a fascist dictatorship” -NR

    Fascist (insult)

    “Fascist has been used as a pejorative epithet against a wide range of individuals, political movements, governments, public and private institutions. The widespread use of this term as an insult was noted as early as 1944, when British writer George Orwell commented that “the word ‘Fascism’ is almost entirely meaningless”…the Soviet Union made frequent use of the fascist epithet…it was widely used in press and political language to describe its ideological opponents [for example] social democracy was called social fascism and regarded by communist parties as the most dangerous form of fascism…Fascist was used in the Soviet Union to describe virtually any anti-Soviet activity or opinion. According to Marxism–Leninism, fascism was the “final phase of crisis of bourgeoisie”, which “in fascism sought refuge” from “inherent contradictions of capitalism”. As a result of this approach, it was almost every Western capitalist country that was fascist”

  52. NR

    Fascism (/ˈfæʃɪzəm/) is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism[1][2] characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy

    In this very comment thread, metamars was openly calling for Trump to declare martial law and seize dictatorial powers, which is the dictionary definition of fascism, so what I wrote was entirely accurate.

  53. Hugh

    For some reason Trumpers don’t like to be called fascist, even though they back a fascist. You would think after years of all that MAGA, white nationalist, racist, only our leader gets to win elections stuff they would be over their aversion, but they’re still sensitive to being called what they are.

  54. Ten Bears

    Fourteen Defining Characteristics Of Fascism

    1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism – Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.

    2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights – Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of “need.” The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc.

    3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause – The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.

    4. Supremacy of the Military – Even when there are widespread
    domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.

    5. Rampant Sexism – The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Divorce, abortion and homosexuality are suppressed and the state is represented as the ultimate guardian of the family institution.

    6. Controlled Mass Media – Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common.

    7. Obsession with National Security – Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.

    8. Religion and Government are Intertwined – Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government’s policies or actions.

    9. Corporate Power is Protected – The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.

    10. Labor Power is Suppressed – Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed.

    11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts – Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts and letters is openly attacked.

    12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment – Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.

    13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption – Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.

    14. Fraudulent Elections – Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.

  55. Jerome Corsi, author of 2 books on the Constitution, and the man whose arguments were the main reason I though Trump would win in the Supreme Court, has now written:

    President Trump and his legal team have only begun to fight…the rejection was not made upon the merits of the case, but merely a technicality of standing. Trump’s legal team recalibrated within minutes, and additional suits are in process, some of which have already been added to the SCOTUS docket.

    (emphasis mine)

    That’s not much to chew on, yet. However, when he does his deep dive, it’ll probably, once again, exceed my willingness to listen through it all. I find smaller doses of Corsi, during interviews, to be more digestible.

  56. Willy

    Trumpers, like most evangelical conservatives, are a bundle of mental defenses which looks like insanity to outsiders. I suppose that’d make me a bit angsty, ready to smear outsiders with whatever made me feel better, regardless of any actual facts, if I went that way.

  57. NR

    Don’t worry guys, I’m sure that Trump’s crack team of legal geniuses has a bunch more AFFIDAVITS SWORN UNDER PENALTY OF PERJURY ready to go. Just keep sending in your money, Trumpers, and I’m sure that one of these suits will *finally* be the one that does the trick and disenfranchises tens of millions of voters the way you want.

  58. Hugh

    It’s like some don’t know or don’t care that there is this thing called google.

    Jerome Corsi co-wrote a book that served as the basis for the smearing of John Kerry when he ran for President and gave us the term swiftboating. He promoted the birther conspiracy with Obama. He worked as the DC bureau chief of the conspiracy site InfoWars for a while.

    He was subpoenaed by Mueller. Corsi says he denied that he was Oliver Stone’s contact to Wikileaks although per wiki “Draft court documents released in November showed that he emailed Stone several times, updating him about impending WikiLeaks releases of stolen emails.”

    Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. Corsi looks like he is about a million times less dependable.

  59. KT Chong

    Russiagate was not the beginning of legitimizing a President.

    Birtherism was. The de-legitimization of a President has been escalating since then.

  60. KT Chong

    And Trump was leading birtherism to de-legitimize Obama as the President, so he really should not complain when Democrats have been using Russia to de-legitimize him. It is all karma.

  61. bruce wilder

    oh, please . . . birtherism?

    it started in earnest with Whitewater, a fake scandal bought and paid for by Scaife, but subscribed to by political reporters at the NY Times and Washington Post, some of whom would go on to found

    along the way it the decay of journalism picked up aroma and flavor from Roger Ailes, Maureen Dowd and others.

    it was a river with many tributaries, this building of suspicion and “tribal identities” and trivializing narratives, driven forward by any number of ill-qualified candidates for Sorcerer’s Apprentice: Breitbart? Rachel Maddow? Not to mention the legion of political reporters and editors satisfied by he said, she said and theatre criticism, but unconcerned to explain policy

  62. infowars:

    President Trump’s legal team is filing retooled lawsuits that will be filed in each of the four Defendant States and expanded to Nevada and Arizona.

    “We move immediately, seamlessly, to plan B, which is to bring lawsuits now in each one of the states. We had them ready. They’re just a version of the one that was brought in the Supreme Court. So last night, the president made the decision,” Rudy Giuliani said in an interview.

  63. S Brennan

    “there is this thing called google”

    Notice how Hugh doesn’t capitalize the G in Google corporate name? That’s because Hugh is a disinformation specialist, he wants YOU to believe the corporate entity is like air and water, ever-present, like the undying echo of the big bang.

    Why would Hugh want readers to think that when it’s demonstrably not true, indeed, there is a large CIA office inside of Google headquarters in Mountain View. Oh, that’s right, it’s now DNC doctrine that the CIA has an unblemished record of truth-telling…never mind the man behind the curtain.

    Hugh, you are such a pathetic joke but, I can laugh at how a disinformation specialist like yourself can con so many “sophisticated” people.

  64. S Brennan

    How many here used the “birtherism” argument? By my count a big fat 0, but the “Russia Spy” was used far and wide with our most prolific “disinformation specialists” commenting daily.

    As a percentage, how many mainstream broadcasters used birtherism? 15% tops, giving the DNC the last word on the matter. Most networks [85%] fought hard and long to discredit the Birtherismstory.

    How many 3-letter agencies gave Birtherism credence? 0% tops. All the agencies countered the story vigorously. And how many Special Prosecutors were put in place for four years…or even one day? A big fat 0, that’s how many. And how many intelligence committee members accused Obama of not being a naturalized citizen? Another 0.

    Now when it comes to whether Trump is a Russian Spy and it’s handmaiden, “anything said negatively about a Democrat is Russian disinformation”, the inverse is true. “Russian Spy” was major headlines, top story on nightly news, 3-letter agency chiefs warned us, with great gravitas that it was well documented.

    To compare “birtherism” to “Russian Spy”, in scale of distribution, in scale of severity, in scale of PROSECUTION, in scale of US Taxpayer money spent, shows an advocate of such comparison to be a knave of the first order or…a person so dimwitted that 3rd grade arithmetic is beyond their comprehension.

  65. KT Chong

    Tulsi Gabbard has come up again this week, because she has just sponsored a bill that bans trans-“woman” from competing in women sports. Frankly, I think liberals and progressives have gone insane on the LGBTQ++ issue:

    The Economist:
    Good Morning Britain:
    And, of course, South Park:

    On Tulsi: she is conservative on many social issues, BUT progressive on economic issues and foreign policies. So her positions are actually is the opposites of what the Democratic Party establishment’s positions are: i.e., corporate/establishment Democrats are “woke” on social issue, BUT libertarian/neoliberal on economic issues, and pro-war, pro-intervention on foreign policies. So basically they support “woke capitalism”.

    Tulsi does not exactly fit into the Republican Party either. The GOP is conservative on all fronts: i.e, on all social, economic and foreign policy issues.

    Currently, America does NOT have any political affiliation or party — major, independent, or otherwise — that is conservative on social issues BUT progressive on economic issues and foreign policies. I suspect that a lot of Americans and the so-called “independent” or “non-affiliated” voters fall into this category. They are the people who voted for Joe Biden to get rid of Trump, but then they voted straight Republicans on down ballot. (Which is what has just happened: Trump lost the election, but then Republicans have gained in the House and state legislatures and governors, and held onto the Senate.) Those voters are the the people who support Medical-for-All, free public colleges and universities, marijuana legalization and ending the drug wars, ending forever wars and foreign interventions, probably even some degree of living/universal/subsidized incomes. However, they also HATE the cancel culture, HATE identity politics, HATE social justice warriors, HATE the woke culture. So, when progressives kept talking about (or want to believe that) “Americans are actually progressive”, they are talking about this group of people in a blanket term. If you actually broke them down into social issues vs. economic and foreign policy issues, they might not be so progressive on everything.

    Here is the problem for Democrats and “progressives”: if most Americans are conservative on social issues BUT progressive on economic and foreign policy issues, (and I suspect A LOT of Americans are,) and neither party (Democrats or Republicans) offer everything they want. So they have to pick the one that is “closest” to their position.

    The Democratic Party is “woke” (liberal) on social issues, and libertarian/neoliberal on economic issues, and pro-war, pro-intervention on foreign policies.

    The Republican Party is conservative on all social, economic and foreign policy issues.

    So, the Democratic Party offers the OPPOSITE of what those Americans want, while the Republican Party at least offers what Americans want on social issues (but NOT on economic and foreign policy issues.) Under those matrices, that is why so people who seem “progressive” still vote Republican, (like how Florida has just voted for Trump but also raising the minimum wage, which seems contradictory.) They support Medical-for-All, free public colleges and universities, marijuana legalization and ending the drug wars, ending forever wars and foreign interventions, etc., etc., … BUT they are actually social conservatives. Which is why they still vote for Republicans over Democrats. They know BOTH Democrats and Republicans actually do not really support any progressive economic and foreign policy issues, but at least Republicans are closer to them on social issues. By voting for Republicans over Democrats, hey actually get to stop the whole nonsense of cancel culture, woke identitarinism, social justice.

    When they vote for Republicans, they make compromises/sacrifices on what they want on economic and foreign policy issues for social issues. (On the other hand, Democrats offer them NOTHING, neither on economic, foreign policy or social issues.) Now, if Democrats are actually progressive on economic and foreign policy quadrants, then at least they will offer something to lure away those voters from Republicans, (i.e., some might be willing to make compromises/sacrifices on social issues for gains on economic and foreign policy issues.) As it stands now… Democrats offer NOTHING of what those Americans want, on the social, economic and foreign policy quadrants.

  66. KT Chong

    The four quadrants of political issues are:

    1. Social issues

    2. Economic

    3. Foreign policy

    4. I think immigration could be the fourth quadrant, as it does not strictly fall under economic or social issues. It impacts the economy, (immigration is good for the overall economy but hurts individual Americans… just like free trade is. Whatever economic benefits or gains from immigration and free trade… almost all of them go to the top-percenters. Regular Americans get almost nothing out of immigration and free trade; in fact, they get shafted.) On the other hand, immigration is also very closely tied to the identity politics of Latinos/Hispanics vs. White nationalism.

    Another thing about immigration: it is a LOW PRIORITY issue for progressives on this issue but HIGH PRIORITY issue for conservatives on this issue. That means, for people who say they support immigration reform and a path to citizenship for illegals, immigration is NOT a high priority issue for them, i.e., “it’s nice to have immigration reform, but it’s not that important for me.” They do not let immigration be the issue that determines who they vote for.

    ON THE OTHER HAND, for people who want immigration enforcement, who want to expel all illegal immigrants, who want to reduce immigrants… immigration is a high-priority issue for them. They vote for candidates who run on anti-illegals and anti-immigration.

    Which means, if Democrats run on immigration reform… they are gonna lose to Republicans. Because conservatives on the issue rank immigration at much higher priority than progressives on the issue.

    Which should not come as a surprise: people vote to protect their own (economic) interests. People do not vote to give stuff to other people, i.e., vote to give a path to citizenship to illegal immigrants, vote to give foreigners the opportunity to immigrate to America.

    Tulsi Gabbard is modeate on immigration. She does not have a strong position on immigration. It is not a high-priority issue for her.

  67. NR

    Oh no guys! More lawsuits! Maybe this time Trump’s crack team of legal experts will even get the states they’re talking about right!

  68. Hugh

    metamars brought up Corsi as his “legal” expert. Corsi is a nutcase conspiracy theorist and birtherism was one of the conspiracies he promoted. That’s how birtherism came up on this thread. metamars keeps citing nutcase wingers as his authorities and I keep calling them out by simply googling them. For fascists like SB, this is all terribly unfair and suspect because nobody should be allowed to criticize his Führer or the brainless minions who defend him.

  69. Hugh

    NR, they don’t need reality, or facts, or evidence. All these lawsuits have failed because there is no there to any of them. There was no voter fraud. Trump lost. And the commenters here like their leader can’t handle that.

    These suits don’t have law behind them, there’s no evidence for them, the “redress” sought is beyond extreme, they are sloppily tacked together, they ignore standing or filed in the wrong court or in the wrong state, tomorrow Monday electors will cast their votes, and timeliness which has already gotten suits tossed will toss this last round of suits as well.

  70. nihil obstet

    On progressive economics and conservative culture —

    These go together. Progressive economics protect you when you’re sick, lose income, suffer the financial and personal losses that hang over your head in a “you’re on your own” society. The conservative culture provides a backup that the state won’t. Your family, your faith community, your neighborhood are your insurance, and the conservative beliefs claim to preserve them for you. Adopt a rigorous welfare state and the conservative culture will lose lots of its allure.

  71. Willy

    I thought conservatism was all about coming up with your own reality, being your own Dear Leader. So why all this obsession with some other Dear Leader’s reality?

    I’d dare say that Republican operatives recognized that their ideology would only benefit the very rich, but they needed the votes and so they corralled the most vulnerable thinkers in society, those who need a Dear Leader to do their thinking for them. But those same people would call that a leftist thought. I”d call that thinking brainwashed, but then I remember that Republican operatives specifically targeted the weak minded, and not the ideological. The brainwashing part may already be a significant part of who they already are.

  72. S Brennan

    KT Chong, good posts, much of your thoughts were covered in Thomas Frank’s “Listen Liberal”.

    Sadly, today’s NeoDemicrats, “Liberals”, “Progressives” and Lefties” are incapable of listening, for them, shouting down others, who don’t share 100% of their doctrine, is how one signals ideological virtue.

    But to this “The Republican Party is conservative on all social, economic and foreign policy issues” I would argue:

    1] On foreign policy, the drafting dodging generation of NeoDemicrats, “Liberals”, “Progressives” and Lefties” are now the ones that are ardently pro-war. Hell, they’re chomping at the bit to have the working class fight the Ruskies in say…Syria for their amusement and to show how tough they can be with other peoples lives. Since Bush [the 2nd]’s war in Iraq almost every conservative I know [almost all have had kids or, friends who’s kids went to either the AF-PAK or Iraq theater] eschews war, they have no interest in the neocolonial wars of the Clinton/Bush-Cheney/Obama administration [singular intended].

    2] On economic policy, the verbiage of the NeoDemicrats, “Liberals”, “Progressives” and Lefties” is sharply different but, when it comes to excecution it’s hard to slip a piece of paper between the two. Just recently, Nancy Pelosi refused to make a deal with Trump that would have kept millions fed and off the street in mid-winter, but instead she chose to play a political game with peoples lives. We know this because Pelosi has such a stone heart she bragged about her demonic plan and how it helped Biden. So brazen was Pelosi’s indifference to the working class she went on to boast that none of her demands per-election were genuine, she would be happy to now take the Republican plan. Sadly, all of Pelosi’s strutting caused massive embarrassment among with many Republicans backing away rather than be humiliated by Pelosi’s mephistophelean dealings. In the end, it’s likely Pelosi will take a Covid deal that’ll be 1/4th of what the working class was offered under Trump. Yes, Pelosi’s deal will help, it’s better than 0 but the .01% will get the lion’s share. Trump has complained that the deal is too miserly but his influence at this point is less than zero.

    3] On Social Policy, it has escaped the attention of almost every one on this board but, Justice Neil M. Gorsuch just wrote a majority opinion that expanded the reading of the 1964 Civil Rights Bill to include the entire spectrum of gays and transgenders. Without a doubt, the biggest advance in social progress since 1964. For years NeoDemicrats ruthlessly stripped bills that offered any inclusion of gender deviation. For those who don’t know the streets, the most oppressed group of people in the United States male to female gender expression, killed at rate many times that of young black males, unemployment at a staggering 80% all to the studied indifference of NeoDemicrats.

    Tulsi Gabbard’s bill is NOT anti-trans, it is a fairness issue, men are bigger, even if they take estrogen, those advantages don’t evaporate. It’s not fair to women and girls to have to compete athletically with a male who is still a physiologically male. I am all for letting boys who want to girls be girls but, what’s fair is fair…plus I think it’s cowardly to deprive women, who only recently started to be funded in athletics, of a shot to compete. If transgender male to females want to compete scholastically or in beauty contests with women..fine, I wish them luck but, not in athletics.

    Actually, most Americans agree on ~85% of policies, it’s the media, it’s the 2-Parties, it’s the coastal elites that delight in creating “wedge issues” to exploit, to prevent the basic decency of most people from shining through, from becoming policy.

  73. Willy

    Suddenly SB sounds a little like Steve Schmidt. Strange. Most conservative sources I observe have very little in common with anything ‘liberals/progressives/lefties’. Eliminating abortion and anything LGBT are still very important to them. Conservatives are obsessed with strong white males, inferior black males, and supportive females who know their place in a Western Christian world. To the left, hardly at all. The definitions and perceived causes of systemic racism are worlds apart.

    Economically, I still get condescending lectures about how socialism=Venezuela, as if they’ve never heard of other mixed economies or democratic socialism, in the better developed parts of the world. The term “neoliberalism” is strange to them. Conservatives believe that Communist China outcompetes the USA only because they turned capitalist plus stole a few technologies. Some also say the Chinese have higher IQs while Westerners are stuck with all these blacks and browns. Few believe that it was our own economically libertarian plutocrats (conservative policies of either party) which encouraged all of that to happen.

    Most conservatives still have the utmost faith in the uberwealthy and corporate winners, because they believe that only the best and brightest will win all the contests. All of the “deep state” elites belong to the left. Most of the left believes the elites to be self-servingly corrupt, with only a little meritocracy involved.

    Most conservatives believe that Trump has far surpassed “Clinton/Bush-Cheney/Obama” in undocumented deportations. The stats don’t support this. Ironically, Trump performed better than expected because he successfully conned many voting Hispanics into believing that Biden was a socialist.

    Most conservatives despise the Pope and believe that God speaks through the Donald. Apparently they don’t even believe that God can manage his own religion anymore. Figure that one out.

    Well, I already did. After the current post-election debacle full of unsubstantiated bullshit, I’ve come to believe that leftist pundits were correct. “Leftism” is a mishmash of liberals and progressives who skeptically debate over direction and leadership, while most modern conservatives walk in tribal lockstep at the behest of whatever sanctioned Dear Leader is du jour, as if God himself speaks through them. Most Christians on the left prefer to keep God and mammon separate, just as the Founders wisely intended.

    As for military and police power, please…

    The two ‘sides’ are quite different. I say there’s little no conciliation. The Republican operatives have done their brainwashing job well. There is only hitting bottom or there is deprogramming.

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