A Brief Note On Afghanistan And The Taliban

And that’s why Americans should always be on their knees, praying that God isn’t just.

I think I need to show this post to the Mexican family that moved in across the street in a home for which they paid $365,000 being that they’re Americans now. All those recent and not so recent arrivals from Mexico and all of Latin America and South America and China and Japan and Korea and Russia and hell, you name it, they come from all over to revel in the possibility of God’s damnation of the Great Satan America.

The Mexicans are the first in the neighborhood to have chickens even though it’s against the covenants. Rebels. Very American in spirit in that regard. The original colonists didn’t like or abide by rules either just as Trump supporters.

So many want a piece of this My My Miss American Bully Pie. It beggars belief. How they come and come. They keep coming despite the blowback. Afghanis too. Soon enough, the Taliban will be sending their kids to Harvard and Yale if they already aren’t even after they convert to Han Chinese or especially because of the conversion.

Climate change is going to severely impact Afghanistan’s ability to produce opium at current levels. It currently produces over ninety percent of the heroin found all over the globe.

As everyone knows, heroin is one of many drugs – I’d argue it’s the most popular – used by those in power to both destroy other societies and to tamp down resistance within their own domains.

Don’t worry in a decade or so we will try again with another few countries. This time bombing them will create peace and prosperity. We can await snarls how anyone pointing out the Military industrial complex and its propaganda are murder supporters and dictator lovers. The powerful know best and thinking for yourself is dangerous. Anyone pointing out that American’s war machine has slaughtered more people than any of the countries in the new Axis of Evil are just trolls and bots.

Don’t worry in a decade or so we will try again with another few countries.

I’m sure you will.

Different Clue,

Seriously, what the hell are you talking about. Ian covered the residential school situation very thoroughly and has been extremely vocal about Canada’s shameful treatment of its first Nation communities.

What is it about your standing as a USian would give you the higher moral ground to trash talk any other country’s dealing with its minority population (yes, pretty much always bad throughout human history, it always sucks to be conquered)?

The American revolution was about the unstrained liberty of white property owners to steal native land and break treaties, own slaves, and not pay taxes.

Canada was on the side that was comparatively more restrained and lawful in its conduct towards its first nations. That’s why there’s a heck of a lot more first nation presence in Canada than there are in the US, and proportionally more than 5x higher representation as a proportion of the population.

Say what you will, America has effectively left Afghanistan. That’s a good thing.

With the help of the Han Chinese, hopefully prosperity will come to Talibanistan as it has come to China. I’m looking forward to seeing Fuyao Glass Talibanistan in a few years. Instead of a baseball cap, Chairman Cao can wear a turban and sandals when he visits. When in Rome as he says.

Maybe China can help Talibanistan develop its nuclear program on its path to prosperity.

China Repeats Warning To Citizens To Leave Afghanistan Days After Welcoming Taliban For Talks

Truly words spoken by an open minded individual who isn’t afraid to defend their positions. /s/

@Plague Species,

Maybe the New Chinese Overlords will put up a plaque to the American dead in Afghanistan. Maybe it will read something like . . . . “Here lie some Americans who died to make Afghanistan Chinese”.

It is just as well. Perhaps China will make the Taliban civilized, and keep them that way. At the very least, China will keep order around the copper mines and the railroads taking the copper ore back to China.

China/NKPA and NVA took on the US in open field battles and won. The former is particularly hilarious as the Chinese Army had 1 rifle for every 5 soldiers and was outnumbered and outgunned, yet came within a hair of pocketing and destroying the bulk of the UN Forces in Korea.

The NVA routinely won divisional level fights against the US, and systematically destroyed US bases along the Laotian and Cambodian Borders while routinely penetrating the DMZ. The VPAF holds the distinction of inflicting an 18 to 1 kill ratio in its favor over the US Military’s fixed wing aircraft, even if we exclude SAM/AAA, they still shot down 2.5 US Aircraft for each plane they lost.

As for the Afghan Soviet war, the rebels were by and large, not fundamentalists, they were ex-Afghan Army troops who objected to communist rule backed by tribes who lost power and patronage they had under the King. It wasn’t till the Soviet backed Afghan State collapsed in 1992 that the Taliban rose up and was in response to the utter lawlessness in the country which they moved to put a stop to. If not for the Bush Administration’s decision not take up the Taliban offer to turn over Osama to the Hague, Afghanistan would have had been unified for 16 years now.

There was no reason to invade Afghanistan, the Taliban had nothing to do with it, tried to warn us and turn over Osama Bin Laden before hand, restricted his activities, and were trying to find an excuse to boot him. All Bush had to do was take the Taliban offer.

Because here is the thing: The Taliban follow the Deobandi School of Islam, Al-Qaeda follows Salafi School. Both schools are completely opposed to each other with massive differences in ideology. So much so, the Taliban used Al-Qaeda as canon fodder while planning to rid themselves of them when they were no longer useful.

Bush’s war, caused them to find common ground and intertwine.

Sorry for the minor thread jumping, but it jumped out at me;

A lot of Americans wanted Sanders, and M4A, but the war between the Democrats and the Republicans mattered more, and so that dream died.

AmeriKans are dream stompers.

Tell that to 80-90% of the Canadian first nation population, that the fact they survived whereas they very well may have perished south of the border, doesn’t matter. Who is objectifying and reducing lives to numbers?

Outside of Oklahoma, parts of the Southwest, northern plains, and the Pacific Northwest , practically the only traces of the first nations in the US are the hard for Anglos to pronounce place names and sketchy casinos.

Imperialism is always bad, but to act as though there’s no degrees of difference in actions and outcomes, simply because they all took place under this umbrella, is insulting to all involved. Imperialism was the unquestioned norm for 400+ years, but there were genuine differences in how different European imperial powers conducted themselves and in different times and circumstances.

I called out different clue because they choose to harass Ian on a point that he’s been consistently and unambiguously right about.
DC does so without any reflection in their own moral position on this matter as USian (as I am, shamefully so, I just took a road trip though parts of the Midwest and was start reminded that practically the only thing left of these people are squalid reservations in Oklahoma and the place names), stinks of either ignorance or hypocrisy, either of which deserves to get called out on.

The Taliban of the 90’s is not necessarily the Taliban of today. The first generation were primarily refugee children educated by Pakistanis and Saudis in Pakistan. I don’t doubt that some of them remain alive and even influential, but it’s probably best not to assume that we can predict the modern Taliban’s approach to ruling / governing Afghanistan. (I’m not saying they’ll be great, good or even not evil; I’m saying we don’t know.)

Che,

Maybe I misspoke? I know that the US government further broke their word by turning Oklahoma into a state and letting in a bunch of land hungry “Sooners” but there are still numerous native American nations in Oklahoma that are colloquially referred to as reservations. Cherokees are the most famous group but I was thinking of the Wyandot, who are now based in Oklahoma and Kansas. I actually spent a few years of my childhood in Oklahoma, so I feel like I got more exposure to them compared to most Americans.

As for how they are inside, admittedly my memories are from a few visits from a long ago, but they were certainly more trailers in dirt patch, than say nice suburban housing or prosperous farmsteads.

I’m certainly pro restoration of communal rights and properties to various first nations, especially if those rights trace back to historical treaties that are broken. However, I’m not necessarily optimistic that they would practice better stewardship of the land.

@Hugh

The Taliban was composed of Pashtun natives in the south of Afghanistan who fought the Soviets during the Afghan War as a separate group from the Tajik led groups in the north who were assisted by Pakistan and Osama Bin Laden. United States Agency for International Development was their original backer, providing them with religious books to inculcate children to hate the Soviets.

ISI had zero success working with the Taliban in its early days and was still supporting the Tajik Militias in the north as the Taliban began its advance in 1994.

In 1995, the Taliban grew in power when several warlords with large amounts of military equipment surrendered to them. They took Kabul in 1996.

It was in 1996 that Osama returned to Afghanistan as a guest of Gulbuddin Hekmatyar who was opposed to the Taliban. The Taliban for their part ignored Osama for 2 years till they were in a stalemate and Iran started helping the Northern Alliance. It was at this point that the Taliban began working with ISI and Al-Qaeda but on their terms.

Osama was basically under house arrest during this time and restricted from using a Sat Phone. As long as he kept the canon fodder flowing facilitated by ISI, he was allowed to live while the Taliban reorganized and rebuilt their forces and infrastructure. The Taliban never intended for this to be permanent and were working to get US recognition and aide using Osama as a bargaining chip. Neither Clinton or Bush were interested as Al-Qaeda was a useful bogeyman.

Bush’s war on terror which was not necessary and avoidable is what caused the Taliban, Al-Qaeda, and ISI to join forces where before they were barely tolerating each other for their own separate goals.

In short the US made its own enemies and made allies of people who if they had played it smart, would have knifed each other.

That being said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68B1gtPnGlA&ab_channel=PeakProsperity

New information from Dr. Chris Martenson.

For reference:
Map of US Indian Reservations and Tribal Jurisdictions
(hope it works)

The tribal lands of the former Indian Territory were allotted to individual Natives, ending tribal territorial sovereignty in Oklahoma. Yes, a lot of Natives still live in Oklahoma, some on original family allotments. Tribal nations still exist, but until last year, they were not sovereign over territory the way, say, tribes in the Dakotas are. Some of what Astrid may have witnessed and remembered in Oklahoma were areas where poor people were living, poor people who happened to be Native. They were not Indian reservations. Believe me, there is plenty of poor white trash in Oklahoma, too. ;-D

I’m somewhat familiar with the Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma. Most Cherokee Nation citizens do not live in Oklahoma, but many of those who do live within the “17 Counties” of Northeast Oklahoma that were originally assigned to the Cherokees upon removal from their homelands east of the Mississippi.

The Cherokee Nation government is primarily responsible for services to Cherokee Nation citizens, including health care, social services, some housing and education and so forth. They also operate casinos and other tribal businesses. But they do not govern territory like tribes in many other parts of the country.

Depending on how it’s implemented, the Muskogee-Creek SCOTUS decision of last year may give Cherokee, Choctaw, Chickasaw, Seminole and Muskogee-Creek governments some tribal legal jurisdiction over their former territories, but I don’t see how it will restore reservations the Nations once had. The land has long been allotted, sold and resold, claimed and reclaimed by so many different people and interests that reassembling it under tribal government would be a Herculean task. Butt stranger things have happened. 😉

@anon,

Have you considered the possibility that the 9/11 attack was US government enabled in order to advance a pre-set US government agenda? Or at the very least the agenda of certain groups of Intel Community people, Bushites, Cheneyoids, etc.?

The anthrax attacks which happened very soon after the 9/11 attacks were conducted with US government military laboratory quality super micronised anthrax spore powder. That was a Deep State attack to get the Senate to pass the Patriot Act.
Yet people keep forgetting about the anthrax attacks.

And it’s actually pretty easy to imagine. Just have a revolution and destroy everyone’s claim to property. This is how Chinese dynastic cycles work, when the entrenched system gets too out of whack, it loses the mandate of heaven, lots of blood is shed and eventually society settles in a reorg that can work for decades or centuries until that too is destroyed by external forces or internal contradictions.

Going back into perhaps too much China booster role again… One thing China doesn’t have is private land ownership. Everything is leased, usually several decades long, from the million dollar condos of coastal cities to tiny fragmentary plots of farm land. There are selling of rights of use and rights of communal ownership running with their respective Hukou or membership in villages. The speculation is that the government will likely renew the leases at some point at a low cost but this structure does give them the legal grounds to completely change ownership structures.

Unlike Americans and the urban hukou holders, the holders of usually despised Chinese rural hukous have a genuine backstop to unemployment. They could go back to their village and be dirt farmers again. Likely to be very hard work and barely eeking out a living, but they can go back home again. This is why I think the Chinese rural to urban mass migration really is more about pull than push factors. The urbanized peasants may be less happy than their previous selves (envy and materialism being great sources if unhappiness, along with long term isolation from their extended families), but they are really drawn to be migrant workers because it pays much better and is typically easier work.

It’s possible that there are some push factors through importation of cheaper agricultural products and mechanization pushing out farm laborors but my impression is that this is much less of a push factor than the WorldBank initiated push to plantation style farming or factory assembly, as seen in Latin America and elsewhere in Asia.

So, to summarize: damaged people continue to do damage to others if unchecked.

And for some reason, all citizens of a country are responsible for all the actions of their government, throughout all time, despite the vast majority having limited, if any, power (or were even alive). The sins of my “father” are not my sins, but I absolutely do recognize they were indeed sins.

The system has always been this way, was set up this way from the very beginning. The system is specifically set up to reward psychopaths and ensure they remain in power, and it has always been this way, for many, many centuries. They have amassed immense wealth and as long as “money” has meaning, as long as ownership of anything remains law, they can buy, and therefore do, anything. And they will. And they are. They are so powerful now, they are killing an entire planet and millions of people (and billions of other living things). It chills me to think that they may have let human populations grow unchecked just for the opportunity it gives them to then kill them.

Meanwhile, the system as designed continues to give them opportunities to address their need to damage and thus ensure relentless misery for the many, power for the few. They slowly chip away what little agency we once had. They employ propaganda to keep everyone off balance and distracted. They’ve had centuries of practice to hone their playbook. Scapegoats are periodically served up to keep people focused away from those actually responsible, and ensures that everyone keeps busy holding responsible everyone except for the people actually responsible.

I am not them. Let me repeat that. I am not them. I am not my abuser. And this is not the time to appeal to a (version of) a god invented to keep people powerless and afraid so as to exploit them. One man tried to demonstrate a different, less selfish way of life that benefits the many, he tried to teach people better ways to behave, to live. And exactly because this was appealing to the miserable masses, it was turned into (as everything is turned into, like the Olympics) an industry to exploit people, and simultaneously amass more money and therefore power.

Industrial religion works by exploiting man’s need for connection, and man’s hubris. The need for connection is very real. The need for arrogance isn’t an actual, inherent need. This is right out of their playbook. They need to feel arrogant, they are arrogant, so they tell you that you must be arrogant. They tell you how to be exceptional. They invent the need, or create the problem, and then sell you the solution just so they can continue to acquire the money and the power needed to remake the world in the image of their insanity.

And now the world does indeed resemble their insanity.

Synoptocon, the ISI supported HIG, Hekmatyar’s group, only until 1994. It only goes to show that Pakistan and its intelligence services were and are heavily involved in Afghanistan, and after 2001 usually worked against their supposed ally the US.

The Taliban started among the Pashtun. The Pashtun are the largest ethnic group in Afghanistan and many live in Pakistan’s Tribal Areas. The Pashtun were a natural entry point for the ISI into Afghanistan. The Tajiks much less so.

Sorry, there are some commenters I steer clear of. So I didn’t see that.