The horizon is not so far as we can see, but as far as we can imagine

And Roe Is Gone: What’s Coming Up on the Chopping Block?

No surprise, leaked opinion was accurate. There’s a decent map here of what it will mean on the ground:

Republicans have spent generations stacking courts, doing whatever they could to put ideologues there. They understood what appointments meant.

If you think Democrats are going to do anything meaningful about this, you are delusional. Democratic leadership does not care, though they’ll fundraise on the issue:

The next time Republicans have the Senate, House, and Presidency they’ll pass a nationwide abortion ban.

Meanwhile, restrictions on guns will be increasingly struck down. Cops no longer have to read people their Miranda rights. Republicans want gay marriage gone. I think they’ll continue to allow cross-race marriages, at least as long as Thomas is on the court, and maybe longer, as they’ll need Hispanic votes. Free public schooling is also likely to go in many states. Contraceptives will be made illegal in many places.

America, fuck’yeah.



Failures of Democracy & the Original Intellectual Fascist


Open Thread


  1. NR

    In his concurring opinion, Thomas said that the Supreme Court should reconsider all of this Court’s substantive due process precedents, including Griswold (birth control), Lawrence (same-sex relationships), and Obergefell (same-sex marriage).

    So that’s what’s next on the agenda for the Republicans.

  2. Ché Pasa

    Beyond reactionary into reversionary territory.

    The march backward which began, oh, in 1981 or so, appears unstoppable even though a huge majority of the public doesn’t want to go back to the past. They’ll have no choice, right? They revert to what once was or they leave or they die.

    It doesn’t matter that most American strenuously reject this path. They don’t have power, do they? They don’t have power and if they did, they wouldn’t know how to use it. So backwards we must go.

    Given the nature of their radical rejectionism, I would advocate for abolishing the Supreme Court, and the Senate along with it.

  3. different clue

    America, fuck’yeah?

    Actually, if any states can keep the Christian Sharia Law Gilead Republican Fascist movement out of their states, then we could have . . . Modernia, fuck’yeah and
    Christian Shariastan, fuck’no.

    But that all depends on if the Modernians are prepared to give up on the ” United States of America” and turn a few possible states into Fortresses of Survival on the way to creating a separate United States of Modernia. And let the rest become a United States of Christian Shariastan.

    And then we could have an exchange of populations the way “India” and “Pakistan” had during and after Partition. With hopefully less loss of life.

  4. Ché Pasa
    QUOTE: “Given the nature of their radical rejectionism, I would advocate for abolishing the Supreme Court, and the Senate along with it.”

    Think BIGGER. The USA is toast. This does to the Union something similar as Brexit is to the UK (Wrexit, haha). Not today or tomorrow, but the acid bath is happening now.
    That’s the internal acid, the external push will come when the beltway geniuses pick a fight with China and have their arses handed to them on a jade platter.

    The only way out is solve et coagula, break up the Union and reconstruct 4 or 5 new second-tier states out of it – giving each of these the opportunity that usually only comes along once ever 200 years – the ability to write a constitution fit for the age you’re living in. Johnny Reb will fail in this of course (hard to hold a pen with six fingers), but there might be a hope for Cascadia, NE, etc., if they can keep the Clintons and the Pelosis off the process. We live in hope.

    I lived in Portland until May (moved back to Ireland after 29 years in the USA). My American wife is well aware that she won the lottery when we met. Tonight, said “I’m never going back”. Wasn’t before this, negative chance of that now.

    When I left Ireland in 1993, abortion was illegal, divorce nada also, gay rights = zero. We expected this to be the status quo forever. One by one those dominos fell. 2015 came along and I was in Portland by then. A canvasser raising signatures for gay marriage came to the door. I mentioned the Irish ref., and pointed out that Ireland would get it before the USA. I was right = but Ireland also got it by direct vote, a popular referendum. By a large margin. And a few years later, the big one, Abortion was passed, by a very big margin = 66.4%!!! Big enough for both to be closed permanently. They will NOT be overturned. We could rerun both refs … the winning margin would only increase. We didn’t get them by a shoddy 5:4 judicial sleight of hand. Of course, we had to wait a LOT longer for abortion, and in retrospect that could have been won maybe 10 years before it was, but again, when yank christo-fundies come to Dublin to stir up shite with their anti-abortion crapulence, all they’ve done is waste a plane ticket. Dipshits should stick to Bumhole Idaho. Know yer place!

    Anyway, when your Floundering Father’s constitution is having rings run around it by the Irish one (written by DeValera, a conservative catholic in the 1930s/40s), it might be time to tear it up and use it for what it’s best suited: arsepaper.

    Better luck next time.

  5. KT Chong

    As a man who lives in California and will NOT be in anyway affected by the Supreme Court decision: I do NOT care about Roe v Wade or the abortion issue either way. Nor the Jan 6 hearing, which I have not bothered to watch or follow at all. I will vote in November based on how the economy and particularly energy and food prices (inflation) are doing, which are currently not looking good for Democrats.

  6. different clue

    @KT Chong,

    Have fun with your Death Valley heat waves, your mega-drought and upcoming water wars and your next pro-Global Warming Republican President in 2024

  7. multitude of poors

    Presidential Striver from birth, Scumbag, Grifter Bar None California Governor Gavin [Getty, Pritzger, et al] Newsom has already set himself up as the hero to choose at the end of the day, he must be wetting his silk underwear with delight over this. Perhaps his Auntie, Nancy Pelosi, is on the phone with him now—in a three-way with Willie Brown—congratulating him; despite his recent performance to set himself apart.

    It won’t matter to many who criminally thrive in California, or live elsewhere—bought, or brain dead—that California is, and always has been a haven for Misogynist, Racist, Classist, Ageist Millionaires and Billionaires since it entered the Union. California’s one of the largest incarceration centers of the world (ask Kamala), and, I have no doubt, one of the largest attempted suicide centers of the U.S. (There’s a reason why the US doesn’t track attempted suicides, which makes no sense, as anyone who’s lived in this hellhole long enough realizes that the vast predominance of suicide attempts fail, so just tracking the successful suicide statistics is a vast deception perpetrated on the public. Yeah Fentanyl deaths by the boatload, of all ages, too bad Gary Webb is gone to report on whose actually providing it, versus the social safety net that’s been missing for forever.)

    At least one third of its residents are so impoverished they’re forced onto Medi-Cal [Medicaid], another 7 million or more inexplicably don’t qualify for Medi-Cal (not that it will do them much good in actually receiving any Hospital care without being patient dumped in a gown and socks from an ER ward they can’t afford), even though they can’t afford their rent for even a shabby studio apartment. Single females can’t even afford to live in most places, let alone afford an abortion, and women with degrees equivalent to males still make far less on a dollar than male than even some Republican states. Oh, and do look up the vile, 2020 California Constitutional Amendment (SCA3>ACA11) solely by the California Congress —and solely Funded By the California Real Estate Industry and the Republic of California—Proposition 19 (in the heat of the 2020 Pandemic) coffin nail for older renters, and poor ‘heirs’ (I commented on it here: ) which Newsome gladly signed on to to steal inherited property from poor heirs and further make Rental Housing utterly unaffordable tossing elder renters in thier sixties onto the cement, as their apartments, bought by their landlords for under 40K, are revalued for property tax purposes at 700K and more.

    By the way, none of the impoverished disabled, who made so little they didn’t have to file taxes, received that $600 stimulus from Newsom; for those Aholes from other states still promoting someone they know absolutely nothing about (or worse, do know how vile he actually is). It certainly wouldn’t be the first time Newsom, just like his Horrid Bipartisan Predecessors, made National MSM Nooze for Benevolence™ on the backs of some of the most vulnerable populations in the state of California.

    California’s Federal House Member (possibly the wealthiest of all of them, with 100% Republican Ohio In-Laws) Ro Khanna is no option either, look at his admiring twits (to this day) about Hillary, Pelosi and Obama (along with his scarcity of Homelessness Twits (and that, frequently in the news in a sordid manner, Fremont Tesla Plant in his District), despite governing in a district known to have exploding unsheltered homeless, hypothermia deaths are not at all uncommon in Sunny™ Silicon Valley) in his two highly active twitter accounts and far more cunning than Newsom .

    It didn’t make sense why Bernie Sanders gave him such a VIP position. Peter Thiel, and other vampires of the public’s blood were actually primary actors in Khanna’s first election victory, which was truly a dirty one, not unlike like so very many historic California Election Victories.

    We are now, apparently in the 24th dimensional chess years, and the Roe Versus Wade Criminality will be used to negate the fact that DC just gave Billions out to Nazis in the Ukraine to perpetrate further war while the US is exploding with poverty, death, Third World, decrepit infrastructure and total hopelessness.

  8. NR

    KT Chong:

    So there aren’t any women in your life you care about? A sister, a daughter, a cousin, a friend, a wife, a girlfriend? Because if there are, this decision does certainly affect them.

    I really hope you don’t find that out the hard way.

  9. Stephen T Johnson

    Those whom the gods would destroy…..

  10. different clue

    A reactionary and well funded and highly Roman Catholic Sharia Law oriented organization called The Federalist Society has existed for several decades and has spent that time working to infiltrate its own hand-picked membership-approved potential judges into every possible level of the Federal Judiciary. Several of the new Roman Catholic Sharia Law Justices on the Supreme Sharia Court are long-term Federalist Society groomees.

    Were the DemParty politicrats not fully aware of this? Were they secretly in favor of it? Are those good questions?

    Here is a link about Federalist Society’s ” Constitution In Exile” concept.

    Here are a few videos from the Federalist Society , so one can get a sense of their outlook. I haven’t watched any. I trust they wouldn’t even post them if they didn’t support the general Federalist Society outlook.

  11. Joan

    @KT Chong,

    This will affect the economy. Women with money will fly elsewhere to get their abortions. I don’t have a lot of money, but I could load up my credit card and fly almost anywhere.

    The women who don’t have that kind of money will be the ones applying for WIC, food stamps, and other welfare. This will also increase the burden on the foster system, which is paid for by your tax dollars.

  12. Astrid

    Pretty underwhelmed. The same country that already destroyed public health, 1st Amendment, dollar hegemony, a couple dozen countries, and the Earth’s entire ecosystem.

    I’m betting that none of this will stop Americans from trash talking about how terrible CCP, Putin, I-Ran, and the French are.

  13. mago

    Dear KT C your adamancy is admirable even if skewed.
    Relax your posture and relax your mind.
    If you feel like it that is.

  14. Willy

    energy and food prices (inflation) are a worldwide event. I’m not sure how the Democrats are impacting places like India and Brazil. Blaming them for Putin’s war has always seemed like a bit of a stretch for me. At most, they’re just trying to match whatever it is that Russia does. BTW, in Russia inflation is double that of the USA and in China half.

    Steve Bannon said the left wants pillow fights while the right goes for the head wound. Maybe that’s why this “populist” prefers to work those people. They’ll do whatever it takes to win while the left prefers to play by rules. But I think it’s a shame that fully three quarters of them have gone full retard hypocritical round the bend. And not in a good way either. That’s far too many people for me willing to do whatever it takes to win at being full retard hypocritical round the bend.

    It seems like yesterday we were talking about conservatives being such nice folks, albeit misguided. Today they just want power over “the other” so they can quietly fly their mistresses out to blue states for their abortions, while making blue states pay for all the problems their many poor women are gonna have.

  15. Trinity

    What’s next?

    Well, I think the plan is still the same. They will own everything, we will own nothing, and supposedly we will be happy.

    They keep forgetting that everything runs in cycles, nothing lasts forever. The push back has already begun, they cannot have their way with everyone and everything forever. It just doesn’t work that way. That’s the long term.

    In the short term, what worries me is they may use this (and that’s why they wanted Roe overturned) to increase surveillance of the public. They seem like they are salivating to build phone apps that will identify women who are not happily pregnant, not to help them but to prosecute them “to the fullest extent of the law”.

    In thinking about this, this could be a precursor to even more surveillance to identify “wrongdoers” for prosecution of just about anything, given that they also now define what’s illegal. Minority Report without the precognition. The first step is to make something we need illegal, and by targeting women first, who are always more vulnerable than men but especially so when pregnant, makes it that much easier.

    I could be wrong, but how many times have they done something that specifically makes it easier for them to later expand their control? There are already news reports about them pressuring Big Tech to collect the type of information that would identify a woman who has an unwanted pregnancy. The most famous AI case, now years ago that started the whole AI deluge, was an algorithm that identified women who were in the earliest stage of a pregnancy. Back then it was so they (Target, the big box store) could upsell to that woman for basically the next 18 years, beginning with mailing her diaper coupons and other birth related items. How quaint 2012 seems, now.

  16. bruce wilder

    @multitude of poors

    that was quite a rant, but you hit a ripe target: the corrupt, feckless “lesser evil” Party that has pretended to “try” and “care” while always being ineffective is responsible, too — or rather all those fools who argued their case while ignoring the reality

  17. different clue


    If “Blue States” is going to equal “Legal Abortion” states, then the Legal Abortion states should force the Illegal Abortion states to eat every bit of their own self-caused pain. That means that the Illegal Abortion state conservatives must not be allowed to ship their wives, daughters, sisters, nieces, mistresses and etc. to Legal Abortion states to get abortions. These “women of the rich” must be forced to stay in their own Illegal Abortion states and carry their forced-childbirth pregnancies to term.

    Legal Abortion states should make it very clear and very real that the only way a woman can get a legal abortion in a Legal Abortion state is to be a Genuine Physical resident of that state. Women of the Illegal Abortion states must be made to know and accept the basic fact that the only way they will have any access to a legal abortion is to have already-been a resident of a Legal Abortion state.

    Shutting off that escape hatch for the conservative hypocrites who rule the Illegal Abortion states could be used to leverage the slow and steady brain drain of pro-legal-abortion women from the Illegal Abortion states to the Legal Abortion states. The Legal Abortion states should carry that process far enough to begin depopulating the Illegal Abortion states and reducing their economies and material standards.

    South Dakota is non-populous enough that if every Legal Abortion state within reach of South Dakota were to ban South Dakota women from getting an abortion in every one of the Legal Abortion states, they could over time brain-drain enough women out of South Dakota and into the Legal Abortion states as incoming residents that they could down-populate South Dakota to where it can no longer be a viable state or even a society at all. If that could be achieved, it would show the possibility of doing it to larger and more populous Illegal Abortion states. It would be a way to degrade and attrit the economic, political, and Congressional Representation power of the Illegal Abortion states.

    Or the social suicide kumbaya liberals can show off how nice they are by letting women from the Illegal Abortion states get abortions in the Legal Abortion states and preen themselves in public while the Illegal Abortion states gain the power to make abortion illegal in all 50 states.

    That is always a choice the kumbaya liberals can make. And given their belief in Beautiful Noble Loserhood, that is probably the choice they will make.

  18. multitude of poors

    @Bruce Wilder,

    I’m very glad you found it worth your read Bruce (and pray your faring okay). I can’t possibly overstate the actually pus filled boil that Blue™ California is for most of its wooed, entrapped victims. Those victims will now ultimately include women being led to believe getting an abortion in California is a solution that won’t break their backs.

    Millions of Californians increasingly can’t afford to travel (gas near $7.00 in Silicon Valley/Santa Clara County; which likely has more than ten thousand unsheltered; and who knows how many vehicle dwelling homeless) to an ER ward—and good luck there, where even Non-Profit Hospitals won’t admit Medi-Cal Patients—let alone move out of state.

    Explodingly more homeless in those Blue™ billionaire infested (billionaires currently infesting Hawaii (as are the Obamas) and New Zealand; leaving mostly empty, until the culling has been completed, Bay Area Estates that can take up almost whole blocks) Silicon Valley and San Francisco area communities. Increasingly, the newly homeless are past retirement age elders decimated by: first Clinton/Gore/In-Q-tels’ formal beginning of the Silicon Valley, DOD based Technocracy; then Cheney/George W. Bushs’ let’s bomb the fuck out of a Sovereign Country Recession; then the Obama/Bidens’ welcoming of Mark Zuckerberg, et als’: coders only need apply (preferably via H-1B visa so they can’t vote for fair rental laws, etcetera) and ordained age discrimination (35 is over the hill for the hapless non millionaire/billionaire/politico, spook, snitch, kiss ass, etcetera), along with that Great™ Recession.

    They were single renters, never able to afford a home, staying here for both family members they rightfully weren’t willing to desert, and jawbs that paid enough to be okay; until they were inexplicably and criminally dumped from them, never to make a decent wage again.

    Take care.

  19. Ché Pasa

    Trinity puts her finger on where this is going. And it won’t be long now before the final nails are pounded into the coffin of “Our Democracy.” The Court, after all, is not acting in a vacuum. Far from it. They have the full support of very powerful interests. The majority is there precisely because of those interests. Surveillance is a necessary component of what’s to come.

    Note the cognitive dissonance of declaring one day that privacy was guaranteed by the Constitution — for gun carriers — and no state has the authority to require “good cause” for carrying firearms in public. The next day the same Court declares no Constitutional right to privacy for women who may be pregnant, no right to bodily autonomy, and no prohibition on States’ legislating against abortion with the strong implication that states can legislate as they see fit and proper anything they wish with regard to sexual and other relationships, marriage, and private behavior of all kinds.

    I call this reversionary, but it goes much deeper than that. It’s leading to a recreation of society in a mold that’s never happened — because it couldn’t — in this country before. It’s beyond authoritarianism or even totalitarianism. We’re facing a future of no rights — for the People — except in the abstract, and all power accruing to a tiny minority of individuals who think they know best. The Court will declare this the intent of the Founders, and in fact they won’t be far from wrong.

    It can’t be accomplished without intense surveillance of the population, something that is now possible — most components are already operational. Denying bodily autonomy to some women in some states but not all will be a test of how to implement much more far reaching control — via surveillance — over populations in general, and how to enforce compliance among the resistant. It’s not that it hasn’t been done before. It’s that it hasn’t been done this way before.

    Power is quite a drug, isn’t it?

  20. someofparts

    It feels like I’m watching the third world and the first world change places right before my eyes. That’s what the Roe thing seems like to me, a lurch toward our future as an impoverished, illiterate, disease-wracked backwater shocking civilized people with our barbarity.

    For people in the conversation who have made it out of the country, I would like to hear how that is working out. I’ve heard that, at least economically, things are going to be as hard in Europe as they will be here.

  21. Art

    Registered as a Republican (Long story involving trying to do what I could to stop RR in the primary) I get a whole lot of input from the right. Some of it from the deep, dark depths of Mordor. Sometimes I go for a dive online and see the stuff the out-and-proud GQP doesn’t want wave around in public. About five years ago I read some stuff from an evangelical preacher that laid out the direction he wanted to go.

    There was the usual stuff: Antiabortion by capturing the courts, ditto gay marriage and either getting God into public schools, public money into religious schools, and/or eliminating public schools. Perhaps all three. Pretty much what anyone paying attention would expect. Importantly all of this has, or likely will, go that way.

    What looked like more of a long shot, less so now, was the commentary on what he wanted to follow:
    Elimination of birth control (except condoms because they are entirely male controlled), removal of women’s right to vote and financial independence, systematic removal of women from the workforce and public life.

    I come from a family of tough men and remarkably strong women. My widowed maternal grandmother raised three daughters in the deeply rural Eastern Shore of VA by herself in the waning years of the Great Depression. It sickens me to see America going this way.

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